Discussion between Philip and Jim Aufderheide
[Ringel locale in the area of Lengerich, Germany]Hmmm. You are right, Philip.
I went into one of the satellites and looked up Ringel, Germany. It appears now to be a wide spot in the road. Perhaps Fred was born on one of these several farms? Perhaps Ringel was never a thriving village. Interesting. I wonder how we could find what was there in 1853?
You know, as I find out more, it just brings up more questions. Isn't it fun?!
Jim Aufderheide
[Philip's Old German Roadmap]
Hi,
In answer to Jim A's mail with the aerial view of Ringel, I scanned my German road map of that area...showing Lengerich, Kattenvenne, Ringel ....and I might add, Wiethoff. Lienen is on the next page, so that doesn't show up.
If you would like to see an old map of the area, go back to Darcy's email of March 03, 2007...subject: Re: Aufderheide Pedigree
I too am enjoying this latest whirlwind of mails.
philip
Thanks, Philip.
You know, they all are in relatively close proximity. So I see Kattenvenne Moor on the map...but that is not a Heide, is it? Isn't a moor a Mark?And I went back and printed out Darcy's older map. Can't tell how large a hamlet Ringel it is. Question: if there really is not village there anymore, why is Ringel still on the map? Or is that like a township designation? We have Milford Township outside of New Ulm, but there are no buildings, per se, and really never were other than a township hall.I didn't notice the JAP when I copied and pasted.
I wonder if I should talk to my wife about going back to my original surname: JAN UP DE HEE. Actually, that almost sounds Dutch! I received an article from a friend about the origins of surnames. They apparently did not begin until the middle ages, and, with the changes in language, those developing surnames changed much into the 18th and 19th centuries.
Our JAN UP DE HEE to JOHANN AUF DER HEIDE to AUFDERHEIDE is a terrific example of that development.
Jim Aufderheide
To me this whole process is so exciting, so mentally fulfilling. What are the chances of a group of relatives with the will, the motivation, the interest, the intellect, the creativity that you folks have coming together on one endeavor like this? How absolutely fascinating! I am in awe watching a group like this!The view from satellite made me think of an older email exchange between you and Darcy where you talked about Fred being born in a small farm house in Ringel. What are the chances that one of those buildings around that wide spot in the road pictured in the satellite shot was where he was born? I wonder how we could ever know?Think of the importance to our families of that location...
Think of the importance to our families of the location of the farm in the picture that Gerhard and Helga sent us... What a rush!!!
Jim Aufderheide
Dear Jim,
Ringel is a "place", if not a little village. If there is such a thing as a township, this one would be Lengerich...since these little hamlets go by the name Lengerich-Ringel etc. "Moor" is a fen (=venne...remember that v is pronounced as our f in German) or bog, but is not unconnected to "Heide". "Mark" is usually used in this form to indicate a border area. However, I have also seen it used to indicate fields or woods that are used in common by a community. There may be other uses.I doubt that Ringel was ever larger than it is now. Farmers generally live together in Germany with their fields surrounding the little collection of houses.
The scale of the map can be seen by the red numbers which indicate the number of kilometers between the red markers on roads. The large numbers indicate distance between the large markers with a circle instead of a dot. I mile = 1.6 kilometers.I wonder if William Wiethoff came from WIETHOFF on this map. Did he know Bernadina Aufderheide before he emigrated? A peek into the book of emigrants from Lengerich that Heidi Johann adH mentioned might give some clues to that.
My 2 cents.
p.
In answer to Jim A's mail with the aerial view of Ringel, I scanned my German road map of that area...showing Lengerich, Kattenvenne, Ringel ....and I might add, Wiethoff. Lienen is on the next page, so that doesn't show up.
If you would like to see an old map of the area, go back to Darcy's email of March 03, 2007...subject: Re: Aufderheide Pedigree
I too am enjoying this latest whirlwind of mails.
philip
Thanks, Philip.
You know, they all are in relatively close proximity. So I see Kattenvenne Moor on the map...but that is not a Heide, is it? Isn't a moor a Mark?And I went back and printed out Darcy's older map. Can't tell how large a hamlet Ringel it is. Question: if there really is not village there anymore, why is Ringel still on the map? Or is that like a township designation? We have Milford Township outside of New Ulm, but there are no buildings, per se, and really never were other than a township hall.I didn't notice the JAP when I copied and pasted.
I wonder if I should talk to my wife about going back to my original surname: JAN UP DE HEE. Actually, that almost sounds Dutch! I received an article from a friend about the origins of surnames. They apparently did not begin until the middle ages, and, with the changes in language, those developing surnames changed much into the 18th and 19th centuries.
Our JAN UP DE HEE to JOHANN AUF DER HEIDE to AUFDERHEIDE is a terrific example of that development.
Jim Aufderheide
To me this whole process is so exciting, so mentally fulfilling. What are the chances of a group of relatives with the will, the motivation, the interest, the intellect, the creativity that you folks have coming together on one endeavor like this? How absolutely fascinating! I am in awe watching a group like this!The view from satellite made me think of an older email exchange between you and Darcy where you talked about Fred being born in a small farm house in Ringel. What are the chances that one of those buildings around that wide spot in the road pictured in the satellite shot was where he was born? I wonder how we could ever know?Think of the importance to our families of that location...
Think of the importance to our families of the location of the farm in the picture that Gerhard and Helga sent us... What a rush!!!
Jim Aufderheide
Dear Jim,
Ringel is a "place", if not a little village. If there is such a thing as a township, this one would be Lengerich...since these little hamlets go by the name Lengerich-Ringel etc. "Moor" is a fen (=venne...remember that v is pronounced as our f in German) or bog, but is not unconnected to "Heide". "Mark" is usually used in this form to indicate a border area. However, I have also seen it used to indicate fields or woods that are used in common by a community. There may be other uses.I doubt that Ringel was ever larger than it is now. Farmers generally live together in Germany with their fields surrounding the little collection of houses.
The scale of the map can be seen by the red numbers which indicate the number of kilometers between the red markers on roads. The large numbers indicate distance between the large markers with a circle instead of a dot. I mile = 1.6 kilometers.I wonder if William Wiethoff came from WIETHOFF on this map. Did he know Bernadina Aufderheide before he emigrated? A peek into the book of emigrants from Lengerich that Heidi Johann adH mentioned might give some clues to that.
My 2 cents.
p.
2 comments:
My grandfather was Herman Ringle. He came to Toledo Ohio USA in aboout 1860. He married a girl named Fritz and they had 6 boys. Grandfather Herman disliked all the
English and found that their last name is spelled Ringle just like his spelling. So he changed the spelling of all of his boys to Ringel. I was born in 1933 and my only other sibling Roger was born in 1930. We have just one first cousin from all those Herman Ringel
grand children. So there are three in our generation. But I took care of that and I now have five boys all named Ringel; of course and my brother has one son. My only daughter is named Andrea Shackle. Roger has two daughters still named Ringel; Jackie and Sharon. We both live in the Monroe
Michigan area. My brother in Carleton. I live in Temperance.
My hobby is flying. I fly the Cessna Cardinal (C177). And of course I take lots of digital pictures of my 23 grand children.
I was a computer programmer starting in 1963 through 1993. I built my own house and my own cottage on a lake. All of us are motorcycle savy and there are 14 motorcycles in the extended family. Ringel Germany must have affected the genes of my brother and I. We both live out in the country. Not city slickers.
I am Lutheran (Imagine that.)
Hello,
My name is Erik Aufderheide. My great grandfather, Joseph Aufderheide was born in Spenge, Westfalen in 1840 or 1841. Later, he emmigrated to Indianapolis, Indiana, USA.
I am looking for current contact information for Renate Dry and Gerhard Johann auf der Heide, who have information on my family.
erik.adh@comcast.net
3Mar2019
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